Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin

[Popeye_Card]

I'm not saying "go sweatshops!" or anything like that, but if foreign workers are making more than they would otherwise to do these jobs, and the businesses are paying less than it would cost to pay a domestic worker for the equivalent work, then both sides benefit.

/Devil's Advocate

That's short-term, selfish thinking in my mind.

I think saving all the jobs for Americans is selfish. I recognize the businesses aren't doing this out of altruism, but the end result is beneficial to the rest of the world. Particularly "second" and third world countries.

The second and third world countries have their own economies to fix. I don't think we're really fixing them for them at this point. We're really only making their problems worse, IMO.

[taxman]

That said, I put most of the blame for the fiscal irresponsibility mostly on Congress. Earmarks and federally funded local projects... I'm a Republican and I liked the idea of Clinton's line-item veto.

I don't know if I can get behind a line-item veto. Theoretically it could help cut out a lot of the tacked-on riders to important legislation, thereby stopping a lot of the pork. But it could also be used to change a bill that what passed Congress to such a point that what the President signed into law would hardly be recognizable as the original bill. That puts a lot of power in the Executive, and goes against the checks and balances set up in the Constitution.

I think a better solution would be to apply the "germane amendment" restriction that the Senate operates under to the House as well. That should stop a lot of the riders from ever making it out of Congress to begin with.

Or just ensure that the line item veto amendment refers only to items of authorized spending.

[heyzeus]

The line item veto is probably a dead concept. I haven't read the case since law school, but the Supreme Court put the smack down, essentially saying it was a violation of separation of powers, giving the executive too much legislative authority.

[Fat Strat]

The line item veto is probably a dead concept. I haven't read the case since law school, but the Supreme Court put the smack down, essentially saying it was a violation of separation of powers, giving the executive too much legislative authority.

No doubt it's unconstitutional, I just think there should be some sort of responsible oversight somewhere in the process.

[Popeye_Card]

The line item veto is probably a dead concept. I haven't read the case since law school, but the Supreme Court put the smack down, essentially saying it was a violation of separation of powers, giving the executive too much legislative authority.

No doubt it's unconstitutional, I just think there should be some sort of responsible oversight somewhere in the process.

Perhaps it should be a VP duty, as President of the Senate?

[Popeye_Card]

Shooting down another tangent, what is everyone's thoughts on Joe Lieberman last night? I personally didn't care for it at all. He comes off as a scorned lover. Seems too transparent to actually work.

[Fat Strat]

The line item veto is probably a dead concept. I haven't read the case since law school, but the Supreme Court put the smack down, essentially saying it was a violation of separation of powers, giving the executive too much legislative authority.

No doubt it's unconstitutional, I just think there should be some sort of responsible oversight somewhere in the process.

Perhaps it should be a VP duty, as President of the Senate?

Palin has the experience to handle that job.


I don't know about that. It still gives executive control over congress. Maybe the VP or Speaker can force a vote to break a bill into sections, with each section having to pass with majority approval. Then you could force votes on riders seperately from the meat of the legislation. With both parties actively wanting their pork pushed through, you could see some interesting coallitions form AND it would provide good info to the public on how legislators actually vote for and deal with pure pork.

[sighyoung]

Shooting down another tangent, what is everyone's thoughts on Joe Lieberman last night? I personally didn't care for it at all. He comes off as a scorned lover. Seems too transparent to actually work.

[jim]

Shooting down another tangent, what is everyone's thoughts on Joe Lieberman last night? I personally didn't care for it at all. He comes off as a scorned lover. Seems too transparent to actually work.

Haven't seen him in years. In college I watched everynight, I used to like it when he dropped watermelons and stuff off the 3rd story window. Or stupid people tricks was good too. The pet tricks were pretty impressive.

Is his Mom still alive?

[JCShutout]

Because if there’s a poor child out there, that’s my child. If there’s a senior that’s having trouble, that’s my grandparent. If there’s a guy who’s lost his job, that’s my brother. If there’s a woman out there without healthcare, that’s my sister. Those are the values that built this country. Those are the values we are fighting for."[/i]

++ infinity. I'll risk a joeybomb: Its stuff like this (more democratic ideal than republican) that makes me confused why Christians stereotypically vote republican and why liberals tend to stereotypically shy away from Christianity. I mean, this is the Gospel. Do unto others... as you do to the least of these... love your neighbor as yourself (etc etc)...