HJ's Declaration of Demographic War

[Arthur Dent]

It seems the topic of this thread has changed. I'm glad we now all agree that there is no Social Security crisis necessitating a demographic war and have moved on to deciding whether or not Social Security is a good investment program.

First, Social Security is not an investment program and was never intended to be one. It's a social insurance program that provides a base level of income in old age, and it's quite effective at that. It's funny to hear the people complaining about projections of a small shortfall that may or may not occur over 30 years from now, advocating putting the money in the stock market where there are no guarantees at all and no way no make 30 year projections with any accuracy. The current program is absolutely critical to many people. Social Security benefits are the primary income for a huge proportion of seniors so much so that something like half would be in poverty if the program were canceled today. Of course, it's not a good idea to rely on just Social Security for retirement. Everyone is completely free to save for their own retirement with whatever strategy they like including risky investing. There is no barrier to claiming the upside of these strategies.

Social Security insulates people from the risks of financial markets which may decide to crash right when you want to retire. Americans are not good at saving (the personal savings rate is near zero), so Social Security is also a way of forcing saving to ensure people don't starve or are forced to sap off their children in old age -- both major problems before Social Security was created.

Furthermore, the solutions to the supposed problems of Social Security are mostly awful. All the privatization plans would pull funds needed to pay benefits for current retirees into other accounts. This would certainly cause a real financial crisis. So, the proposed solution to a hypothetical and small shortfall in funds 30 years in the future is to create a very real and expensive crisis today.

There is virtually no support for privatizing Social Security. The only way to have any possibility of making such a change was to invent these phony stories about a financial crisis in Social Security and claim that privatization is the cure.

[Hungary Jack]

I'm glad we now all agree that there is no Social Security crisis necessitating a demographic war and have moved on to deciding whether or not Social Security is a good investment program.

Speak for yourself, AD.

It surprises me that younger people are not more outspoken about inequity of the plan based on current projections. A 20+% cut in benefits is not chump change. Perhaps younger people are aware of this, and are resigned to it, or just don't care. Or perhaps they aren't fully aware of the potential problems ahead. I'd guess it's more the latter.

But I'm OK with being a voice in the wilderness. The political process today is largely dominated by Boomer interests. They are the largest voting block, after all. It's just another thing that younger generations will have to deal with down the road.

[Arthur Dent]

But I'm OK with being a voice in the wilderness. The political process today is largely dominated by Boomer interests. They are the largest voting block, after all. It's just another thing that younger generations will have to deal with down the road.

You're hardly a voice in the wilderness. There's a huge cadre of pundits constantly pushing this fake problem. If you're really that worried about pessimistic 30 year projections, then let's eliminate the cap on income subject to the payroll tax. Problem solved.

[Hungary Jack]

Yes. Raising taxes is a great way to solve problems--if you are a government employee.

Government: the best growth industry since the dawn of time.

[Arthur Dent]

Yes. Raising taxes is a great way to solve problems--if you are a government employee.

Demographic wars: now there's an even better way to solve problems. I'm preparing my arsenal of insults to throw at my parents already: You didn't fight in a non-existent European War! You enjoy traveling! You think that medical insurance should include prescription drugs! Those bastards. We'll get them.

[Hungary Jack]

Yes. Raising taxes is a great way to solve problems--if you are a government employee.

Demographic wars: now there's an even better way to solve problems. I'm preparing my arsenal of insults to throw at my parents already: You didn't fight in a non-existent European War! You enjoy traveling! You think that medical insurance should include prescription drugs! Those bastards. We'll get them.

Sorry AD. I don't really intend to declare war on my parents, or anybody else's.

This thread is officially done.

[Arthur Dent]

This thread is officially done.

Yeah. This got more contentious than it should have. I'm glad that we at least agree on the facts.