Coronavirus

[cardinalkarp]

The fact that that guy is not the inventor of MRNA vaccines and labels himself as such is a bit of a red flag. So is Bret Weinstein and yes, RFK.

If you want to split hairs fine, but he had an integral part in the mRNA vaccine technology. But everyone is going to want to see what they want. The misinformation machine works on both sides.

Did you even bother to listen at all and maybe form your own opinion instead of what you’re being told?

[ghostrunner]

The fact that that guy is not the inventor of MRNA vaccines and labels himself as such is a bit of a red flag. So is Bret Weinstein and yes, RFK.

If you want to split hairs fine, but he had an integral part in the mRNA vaccine technology. But everyone is going to want to see what they want. The misinformation machine works on both sides.

Did you even bother to listen at all and maybe form your own opinion instead of what you’re being told?

Splitting hairs? This is from his website.

RW Malone MD, LLC’s was co-founded and managed by Dr. Malone. The inventor of mRNA vaccines and one of world’s foremost experts on messenger mRNA therapeutics - having invented the field in 1988, Dr. Malone has extensive research and development experience in the areas of pre-clinical discovery research, clinical trials, vaccines, gene therapy, bio-defense, and immunology.

Everything I can find online crediting him with being the inventor of MRNA vacciness is from his website, his LinkedIn, or sources from those places.

That's a pretty big credibility problem, so I'm not going to spend time watching it.

What's more, looking at that guy's timeline, he appears to believe in or be passing on multiple varieties of vaccine criticism. That's another red flag. I could buy it if he were focused on something related to his field, like this doctor from last year who I was skeptical about but presented a pretty clear, focused case against the approach to ventilator usage:

https://www.webmd.com/coronavirus-in-co ... yle-sidell


I think if there were serious problems or concerns with the vaccine we'd see some serious disagreements in the scientific community and there just aren't outside a few outliers. Sure I think there's some vested interest in getting people back to work and school, and another on the part of drug companies, but I also think there's plenty of genuine vested interest in actual public health. There are a lot of "competing" actors who are about 85% on the same page with regard to this - scientists, reporters, public health officials, politicians. There are disagreements about how to approach messaging, whether there should be booster shots yet, whether or not to mask, etc... I heard some really thoughtful criticism of the CDC's approach to reporting breakthroughs earlier today. But overall the recommendation across the board is to get the vaccine. So far we're at about half the country getting the vaccine, and likewise for multiple other countries. Test subjects have now had it about a year. If there were serious or extensive problems we'd be seeing those or there'd be a lot more noise aside from the usual vaccine skeptics.

The number of people vaccinated in the US is now about 5 times as high as the number of cumulative Covid cases (which includes repeats). We've had 619,000 Covid deaths. Even if you assume these numbers are slightly off it's clearly less detrimental to get the vaccine than it is to get Covid.

[cardinalkarp]

I think if there were serious problems or concerns with the vaccine we'd see some serious disagreements in the scientific community and there just aren't outside a few outliers

If you haven’t noticed the way the “outliers” have been demonized, de-platformed, and defunded….basically becoming a “crazy person” you can imagine the hesitancy from someone who still wants a career in the medical field.

[haltz]

These guys are promoting daily use of Ivermectin which may be great for all I know based on 2,200 people in randomized trials, over the vaccines which essentially have a trial of 160 million that looks to be over 99.999% effective against death.

It's so irresponsible his buddy Sam Harris is calling him out publicly.

[ghostrunner]

I think if there were serious problems or concerns with the vaccine we'd see some serious disagreements in the scientific community and there just aren't outside a few outliers

If you haven’t noticed the way the “outliers” have been demonized, de-platformed, and defunded….basically becoming a “crazy person” you can imagine the hesitancy from someone who still wants a career in the medical field.

If you are taking credit for research you didn't do, you're a quack no matter your history and expertise. The deplatforming thing I'll just disagree on. My concerns about FB, Twitter and Google/Youtube have to do with size and concentration of power, not whether they choose to ban individuals from their site. Every online forum has those abilities and rights - this one, Facebook, Reddit, etc...

Anyone can start a website - as that guy has. And you posted his video here, linking to another site.

[Jocephus]

i know it's off topic but that's one thing i get "annoyed" at...actual freedom of speech doesn't come with a terms of service thus being removed from social media shouldn't be considered violating freedom of speech.

[cardinalkarp]

Okay, if you’re hesitant to listen because you think he’s falsifying his accomplishments that’s fine.

But the main hesitancy I have in the vaccine is that there’s just not enough known about it yet. And I’m not sure if it was in this thread or the politics one but someone mentioned that we’re one year into the final trials being completed and there are no huge side effects up to this point en masse, but there are reasons vaccine trials take YEARS to complete. Side effects don’t always crop up in 3 or 6 months….or even a year. Side effects can happen years into the trials so we won’t know the true safety of this vaccine years from now, so for people to say “it’s safe, no need to worry” is just not really an answer they can honestly give. I understand why they felt the need to get it out so quickly (well on top of wanting to rake in $$ hand over fist….this pandemic created 9 new billionaires coming out of the pharmaceutical industry). But sue me for remaining hesitant.

[mikechamp]

The CDC is now back to saying masks indoors for all.

CDC updates guidance, recommends vaccinated people wear masks indoors in certain areas

To prevent further spread of the Delta variant, the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention updated its mask guidance on Tuesday to recommend that fully vaccinated people wear masks indoors when in areas with "substantial" and "high" transmission of Covid-19, which includes nearly two-thirds of all US counties.

"In recent days I have seen new scientific data from recent outbreak investigations showing that the Delta variant behaves uniquely differently from past strains of the virus that cause Covid-19," CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky told a media briefing on Tuesday.

"This new science is worrisome and unfortunately warrants an update to our recommendations," she said. "This is not a decision that we or CDC has made lightly."

New unpublished data showing that vaccinated people infected with the Delta coronavirus variant can have as much virus as those who are unvaccinated is the primary driver for the CDC's latest mask guidance change, a source involved with the decision process told CNN. Overall, vaccinated people still play a small role in transmission and breakthrough infections are rare.

In addition, the source noted two other factors that led to this decision: the prevalence of the Delta variant and low vaccine uptake.

When the CDC previously revised its guidance on May 13 for vaccinated people to unmask, Delta only represented 1% of reported infections. Now, according to the CDC, it represents at least 83% of cases.

The source also noted that the country's overall level of vaccination is lower than what was initially expected and that most transmission is happening in areas with vaccination levels below 40% of the population.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/27/health/c ... index.html

[Famous Mortimer]

Okay, if you’re hesitant to listen because you think he’s falsifying his accomplishments that’s fine.

But the main hesitancy I have in the vaccine is that there’s just not enough known about it yet. And I’m not sure if it was in this thread or the politics one but someone mentioned that we’re one year into the final trials being completed and there are no huge side effects up to this point en masse, but there are reasons vaccine trials take YEARS to complete. Side effects don’t always crop up in 3 or 6 months….or even a year. Side effects can happen years into the trials so we won’t know the true safety of this vaccine years from now, so for people to say “it’s safe, no need to worry” is just not really an answer they can honestly give. I understand why they felt the need to get it out so quickly (well on top of wanting to rake in $$ hand over fist….this pandemic created 9 new billionaires coming out of the pharmaceutical industry). But sue me for remaining hesitant.

There's been work on creating vaccines for other COVID variants for years, and they're fairly similar to COVID-19, which is why they were able to use all that information and quickly make one for this. This information is widely available, so I'm not sure why you're treating this as if they started from scratch in March 2020.

I agree that people getting rich from providing healthcare is a bad thing, and should be stopped. But your equivalence is like not driving a car because car maunfacturers are extremely wealthy, or not living in a house because property moguls are ripping us all off.

I see people complaining about "tyranny" got their way in St Louis County last night, where there was a protest of a few hundred people who love their country but aren't prepared to do the least thing to keep their country safe. I think those on the political right who aren't insane demagogues realised a little too late that, with there now being a movement against all vaccines, that their constituency is in danger of dying out.

[Freed Roger]

https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/gov ... b36fc.html
Southwest MO Increase in Covid Among Children

“We’ve seen a rise in cases in that 0-11 age group, and we’ve also seen outbreaks in settings like day cares and camps,” Towns said

Steve Edwards, the CEO of Springfield-based CoxHealth, said his hospital added capacity to the morgue this week as it and nearby Mercy Springfield had a combined 34 deaths in their hospitals over a four-day period.

The average age of those who are dying has drastically decreased in recent months. In Greene County, the average age of the 32 residents who died in July was 63 — down from 88 in March 2020.

“Vaccination is the most important tool for us to get out of COVID,” said Dr. Clay Dunagan, who leads the St. Louis region’s pandemic task force. “Once we get to sufficient levels (of vaccinated residents), the virus will stop circulating and we can put this behind us for some time.”