Fat Strat wrote:Watched the last two episodes of the Americans this morning. Got a lot of the same questions that you have AW. Still, incredible series.
Went back and watched it a little more in detail and the overthrow attempt/scenario makes more sense now.
According to Claudia it seems like they had to manufacture evidence against Gorbachev without which not enough upper level players like military figures would be on board. So the party was still pretty solidly in gotbachevs corner making it easy to fend off the kgb uprising.
And obviously we have history to write that portion of the story. I’m still not convinced Oleg would be forgotten but whatever.
1. What the hell was Paige doing and what was her future? Jail? She has very much not enough skills to live on the lamb. WTF. By far the plot point that made the least sense even though for emotional value, the train scene was beautiful. My guess is she has plausible deniability that she was not involved, because Stan didn't tell anyone that he found the Jennings out and confronted them at Page's apartment. It's not clear where Claudia went, but only Claudia, Stan, Philip and Elizabeth really know that Page was a spy, and all of them appear to keep it quiet. She's in line for a [expletive] ton of FBI questioning though, just like Henry is.
2. What fate awaited Phillip and Elizabeth? I mean, the Jennings are persona non grata for sure with the inner circle of the KGB that wanted to over throw Gorbechov, right? I mean Phillip quit and Elizabeth thwarted their plan, going as far as to kill a KGB agent. Sure Arkady, probably one of the most pure characters in the show, picked them up in Russia and we're led to believe that I guess they warned Gorbachev about the plot to overthrow him. But, the KGB, a team full of Jenningsesque spies and masterful manipulators, surely won't go down without a fight. I kept expecting someone to kill them in the final scenes. And, if the KGB was that united in an attempt to overthrow Gorbachev, did he even have enough support/strength to withstand a more forceful coup? Seems unlikely. Also, wasn't Gorbachev in America at this point? So, them getting to Russia...serves what purpose other than getting away from the FBI? Did they get to Canada and call Arkady who then called Gorbachev and Gorbachev just takes him at his word and quashes this rebellion from a hotel room in the USA? Again, seems unlikely even with the weakened state of the KGB with the Jennings departure and that other spies death. I wondered this too - would it be safe for them back in Russia, given how they just crossed the KGB? I think the writers imply that history takes care of them; the coup is staved off, eventually the KGB morphs into other agencies, so presumably the renegade faction that was trying to overthrow Gorbachev is sent to a gulag in Siberia.
3. If the Jennings were successful in warning Gorbachev and spoiling the KGB's plans, what then happens to Oleg? Sure, the FBI won't release him easily. But, it seems odd that Gorbachev/Arkady would let one of the most ardent supporters of Team Gorbachev rot in an American jail. Further, it seems doubly odd that Stan - who had to at least somewhat buy into the theory that Gorbachev was better than the KGB - would allow him to rot away. It's the same guy for whom he risked his job to protect earlier. And, that's when they were on opposite sides. If he buys Phillip's explanation about saving Gorbachev in order to maintain peace, and it's more than obvious Oleg was there at great peril to himself for some greater good, how does he reconcile letting the Jennings go while holding Oleg? The show definitely doesn't answer that question, but If I may delve into fan fiction, I believe Oleg is part of a prisoner or spy exchange with the post-parastroika and glasnost Russian government, because both governments will recognize that he was working to protect the peace process.
4. Was Phillip right about Renee? Although, I'm fine with this one going unanswered.They showrunners have said that they told the actress who plays Renee the answer to this question, but she is sworn to secrecy. What a devastating thing for Philip to tell Stan. Did he do this as an act of mercy for a friend? Or to break Stan down, in a (successful) tactic of a desperate spy trying to escape from capture?
My other questions:
Where does Claudia go? And is it implied, with Page drinking Vodka in Claudia's safehouse, that maybe someday she will become the next Claudia?
Will Philip get to reunite with Martha in the Motherland? AW-kward!
Does the FBI ever find the bug on mail robot?
I had some issues with the last couple seasons but I thought the Americans finale was near perfect.
I think Paige is fine. I assume there's some awkward and strained reunion with Henry since he has no one else. Not sure how much Stan would have told him about her or how much she would keep from Henry. I imagine she tells him most everything, but that she was also lied to. Which is true and I think partly why she stays behind.
1. What the hell was Paige doing and what was her future? Jail? She has very much not enough skills to live on the lamb. WTF. By far the plot point that made the least sense even though for emotional value, the train scene was beautiful. My guess is she has plausible deniability that she was not involved, because Stan didn't tell anyone that he found the Jennings out and confronted them at Page's apartment. It's not clear where Claudia went, but only Claudia, Stan, Philip and Elizabeth really know that Page was a spy, and all of them appear to keep it quiet. She's in line for a [expletive] ton of FBI questioning though, just like Henry is.See your other spoiler
2. What fate awaited Phillip and Elizabeth? I mean, the Jennings are persona non grata for sure with the inner circle of the KGB that wanted to over throw Gorbechov, right? I mean Phillip quit and Elizabeth thwarted their plan, going as far as to kill a KGB agent. Sure Arkady, probably one of the most pure characters in the show, picked them up in Russia and we're led to believe that I guess they warned Gorbachev about the plot to overthrow him. But, the KGB, a team full of Jenningsesque spies and masterful manipulators, surely won't go down without a fight. I kept expecting someone to kill them in the final scenes. And, if the KGB was that united in an attempt to overthrow Gorbachev, did he even have enough support/strength to withstand a more forceful coup? Seems unlikely. Also, wasn't Gorbachev in America at this point? So, them getting to Russia...serves what purpose other than getting away from the FBI? Did they get to Canada and call Arkady who then called Gorbachev and Gorbachev just takes him at his word and quashes this rebellion from a hotel room in the USA? Again, seems unlikely even with the weakened state of the KGB with the Jennings departure and that other spies death. I wondered this too - would it be safe for them back in Russia, given how they just crossed the KGB? I think the writers imply that history takes care of them; the coup is staved off, eventually the KGB morphs into other agencies, so presumably the renegade faction that was trying to overthrow Gorbachev is sent to a gulag in Siberia.Yes, like I said in a previous post, history kind of answers the question as Gorbachev was not overthrown. Still, in the short term immediately following the storyline of the show, the choppy waters are never addressed so I guess anything is possible.
3. If the Jennings were successful in warning Gorbachev and spoiling the KGB's plans, what then happens to Oleg? Sure, the FBI won't release him easily. But, it seems odd that Gorbachev/Arkady would let one of the most ardent supporters of Team Gorbachev rot in an American jail. Further, it seems doubly odd that Stan - who had to at least somewhat buy into the theory that Gorbachev was better than the KGB - would allow him to rot away. It's the same guy for whom he risked his job to protect earlier. And, that's when they were on opposite sides. If he buys Phillip's explanation about saving Gorbachev in order to maintain peace, and it's more than obvious Oleg was there at great peril to himself for some greater good, how does he reconcile letting the Jennings go while holding Oleg? The show definitely doesn't answer that question, but If I may delve into fan fiction, I believe Oleg is part of a prisoner or spy exchange with the post-parastroika and glasnost Russian government, because both governments will recognize that he was working to protect the peace process.I agree completely even though I've not seen it suggested anywhere (on the internet) that it was implied or even hinted at. Knowing what we know about how relations improved in the future for a while, it seems likely a guy like Oleg would have been released.
4. Was Phillip right about Renee? Although, I'm fine with this one going unanswered.They showrunners have said that they told the actress who plays Renee the answer to this question, but she is sworn to secrecy. What a devastating thing for Philip to tell Stan. Did he do this as an act of mercy for a friend? Or to break Stan down, in a (successful) tactic of a desperate spy trying to escape from capture?I wondered this too. Not sure how deep you can really delve into it as it's obviously a show and not real. But, if I may, I'd think it was more an act of mercy and full disclosure type statement than a psychological breakdown. Stan was letting them leave; Paige and Elizabeth were in the car.
It could have been icing on the cake to get him thinking about something else. But, it's been troubling Phillip iirc as he had mentioned it to Elizabeth previously in a manner that suggested, again iirc, that he wasn't necessarily stoked about the idea. After that heavy conversation, knowing he was going to run and never see Stan again, it's pretty likely that Phillip felt he owed it to Stan to let him know. I'd say in real life, no way you risk agitating a docile and complacent Stan (FBI agent with a gun) with a bombshell like that but what do I know...
My other questions:
Where does Claudia go? And is it implied, with Page drinking Vodka in Claudia's safehouse, that maybe someday she will become the next Claudia?Sure, maybe I guess it's possible. But, she's like a baby spy that hasn't really had the training necessary. Think about all the flashbacks to the stuff Philip and Elizabeth went through. Sucking off old dudes, being raped, tortured, physically/mentally trained well beyond what Paige has gone through. Just look at her trying to roshambo with Phillip as evidence of how far she has to go. Look at all the stuff she screwed up that Elizabeth had to deal with. How Elizabeth isn't even close to trusting her with sources. Etc etc etc. To use an analogy, she's like a baby sea turtle that hatched and has just made it to the ocean. Sure, she's a spy, but she has a long way to go to make it. And, facing FBI questioning, even IF Stan remains silent, is going to be a challenge. Why wasn't she at her apartment when Stan was there (as Stan told Dennis) is going to get that convo off on rocky ground and where was she for the past day. Then, after that, who is going to train her if she makes it out of that line of questioning? I guess if Claudia somehow survives all this, which seems unlikely, she could testify to what was going on and be a point of contact. But, other than that....what is some new person just going to show up and assume Claudia/Elizabeth's role. Elizabeth even says she thinks Claudia could finish it off, but that doesn't mean anyone can. And, I doubt Claudia survives the [expletive] storm she helped create. ANd, as noted, Paige has a LONG way to go to finish training. She doesn't know about killing people. She seemed put off just at the thought of using sex, which Elizabeth did without a moment's hesitatoin, to influence people. Long, long, long way to go. And, for what. She knows her parents are now upset at the very people who employed them. Seems unlikely.
Will Philip get to reunite with Martha in the Motherland? AW-kward!I thought about this too. Who knows. LOL. That would be a pretty terrible reunion for him/her.
Does the FBI ever find the bug on mail robot?LOL I totally forgot about that.
There's an auction of props from The Americans. You can buy the bugged clock from Caspar Weinburger's house or the bugged pen from Agent Gad's office among other things. Mostly clothes. No wigs, sadly.
I haven't watched season 2, but I see there's still a lot of heat on 13 Reasons Why. Perhaps I'm being extra snowflakey, but I thought the way they empowered the teen who committed suicide was bad and dangerous. The 'Then everyone will see' thought process played out with a lot of potency. Bad, IMO.
ghostrunner wrote:There's an auction of props from The Americans. You can buy the bugged clock from Caspar Weinburger's house or the bugged pen from Agent Gad's office among other things. Mostly clothes. No wigs, sadly.
