Former Cardinals Watch

[jagtrader]

Rolen's support will be embarrassingly low.

[MrCrowesGarden]

JB
10:01
Jim Thome, Scott Rolen, Andruw Jones, Omar Vizquel ... which one(s) are Hall of Famers in your opinion?

Jeff Sullivan
10:01
Thome and Rolen

Interesting that he says Jones isn't a Hall of Famer considering he put up almost exactly the same WAR as Rolen and Thome in the same number of years as Rolen. And not to mention he has like 25 more career WAR than someone like Brock.

Rolen was a significantly better hitter than Andruw Jones. A big portion of Jones' WAR comes from defense (moreso than Rolen), but you'll never convince me that Jones was more valuable than Rolen defensively. Defensive WAR gets tricky.

Brock broke the single-season stolen bases record along with the all-time stolen base record, which made him "famous". That gives him a leg up on getting into the Hall of "Fame", in my opinion.

Thome is a tough one. Incredible hitter, but the DH factor is still pretty sketchy for me.

I'll be stunned if he's not a HOFer. 600 home runs without a whisper of steroids (whether that's fair or unfair).

[Spider John]

Brock broke the single-season stolen bases record along with the all-time stolen base record, which made him "famous". That gives him a leg up on getting into the Hall of "Fame", in my opinion.

Maybe he'll give that leg to Rolen since he isn't using it anymore.

[a_smith]

JB
10:01
Jim Thome, Scott Rolen, Andruw Jones, Omar Vizquel ... which one(s) are Hall of Famers in your opinion?

Jeff Sullivan
10:01
Thome and Rolen

Interesting that he says Jones isn't a Hall of Famer considering he put up almost exactly the same WAR as Rolen and Thome in the same number of years as Rolen. And not to mention he has like 25 more career WAR than someone like Brock.

Rolen was a significantly better hitter than Andruw Jones. A big portion of Jones' WAR comes from defense (moreso than Rolen), but you'll never convince me that Jones was more valuable than Rolen defensively. Defensive WAR gets tricky.

By what measure?
Rolen PA 8518 OPS 855 OPS+ 122
Jones PA 8664 OPS 823 OPS+ 111

Thats pretty close for that many plate appearances

[Socnorb11]

122 vs. 111 is pretty significant, to me. Again, just my opinion.

[haltz]

HEY GUYS ITS JI

[haltz]

JIM THOME

[JoeMcKim]

JB
10:01
Jim Thome, Scott Rolen, Andruw Jones, Omar Vizquel ... which one(s) are Hall of Famers in your opinion?

Jeff Sullivan
10:01
Thome and Rolen

Interesting that he says Jones isn't a Hall of Famer considering he put up almost exactly the same WAR as Rolen and Thome in the same number of years as Rolen. And not to mention he has like 25 more career WAR than someone like Brock.

Rolen was a significantly better hitter than Andruw Jones. A big portion of Jones' WAR comes from defense (moreso than Rolen), but you'll never convince me that Jones was more valuable than Rolen defensively. Defensive WAR gets tricky.

By what measure?
Rolen PA 8518 OPS 855 OPS+ 122
Jones PA 8664 OPS 823 OPS+ 111

Thats pretty close for that many plate appearances

Jones was great in his Braves years but after that he was pretty much hot garbage the rest of his career.

[Felix The Cat]

JB
10:01
Jim Thome, Scott Rolen, Andruw Jones, Omar Vizquel ... which one(s) are Hall of Famers in your opinion?

Jeff Sullivan
10:01
Thome and Rolen

Interesting that he says Jones isn't a Hall of Famer considering he put up almost exactly the same WAR as Rolen and Thome in the same number of years as Rolen. And not to mention he has like 25 more career WAR than someone like Brock.

Rolen was a significantly better hitter than Andruw Jones. A big portion of Jones' WAR comes from defense (moreso than Rolen), but you'll never convince me that Jones was more valuable than Rolen defensively. Defensive WAR gets tricky.

By what measure?
Rolen PA 8518 OPS 855 OPS+ 122
Jones PA 8664 OPS 823 OPS+ 111

Thats pretty close for that many plate appearances

Wouldn't the difference be more significant as the sample size gets larger? 8500+ PAs is a lot.

[a_smith]

JB
10:01
Jim Thome, Scott Rolen, Andruw Jones, Omar Vizquel ... which one(s) are Hall of Famers in your opinion?

Jeff Sullivan
10:01
Thome and Rolen

Interesting that he says Jones isn't a Hall of Famer considering he put up almost exactly the same WAR as Rolen and Thome in the same number of years as Rolen. And not to mention he has like 25 more career WAR than someone like Brock.

Rolen was a significantly better hitter than Andruw Jones. A big portion of Jones' WAR comes from defense (moreso than Rolen), but you'll never convince me that Jones was more valuable than Rolen defensively. Defensive WAR gets tricky.

By what measure?
Rolen PA 8518 OPS 855 OPS+ 122
Jones PA 8664 OPS 823 OPS+ 111

Thats pretty close for that many plate appearances

Wouldn't the difference be more significant as the sample size gets larger? 8500+ PAs is a lot.

depends on what you mean by significant. I don't see that big a difference. I hear the word significant and I am thinking larger. Like Pham vs Piscotty, or a random lineup generator vs Matheny. Not a 10% difference.

Rolen had 25 points better BA. They walked the same amount. They had the same power. Rolen had essentially 14 more hits over a season. That is not a lot. But you're right that adds up.

Both had good peaks. Jones played CF vs 3b.

For two guys who came up at the same time, both seem headed for no doubt HOF, and both had big drop offs later in career (Rolen's injury vs jones fat?)
they ended up in similar places.

It is hard not to think that Jones didn't squander his talent and Rolen had his taken away by [expletive] HeeSop Choi in that damn collision.