albertmvpujols wrote:Perron and Bozak aren't third liners because they don't put up 3rd line stats. 3rd liners do not get 40-50 points a year and if they do then you have ridiculous scoring depth. Perron scored the 32nd highest even strength P/60 last year. I don't expect him to repeat that, but he doesn't have to for what he's being paid. I don't particularly care which lines they play on since good teams roll three scoring lines now. These guys are good enough to play on scoring lines. I like the Bozak signing less after the ROR trade, but I'm still fine with it. $4 mil is by no means expensive in an $80 million cap league. Yes, the Blues had some bad signings in Bergy/Sobotka (both now gone). I don't care much about JBow or Gunnarson since both are in the last years of their deals. The Blues didn't have anyone to fill the spots these guys filled today. Bozak could've played a passable second line center and Perron can play on any of the top three lines.
On good teams, 2nd liners don't score 35-45 points unless 20+ are goals, which isn't Bozak's thing (done once, 4 years ago, 11 goals last year, and Perron hasn't done for awhile. Aside from Perron's 50 assists on a scoring happy Vegas team last year, he and Bozak are frustrating players. Not enough production for a scoring line, kinda too talented for a 3rd line. It works when paired with talent (see Perron's year last year). The ROR trade changes everything. I still don't understand the Bozak signing, but I dislike it less, because IIRC, Schenn can play a good RW, and I think he can take a guy like Bozak and make him good enough.
albertmvpujols wrote:JCShutout wrote:By the way, Bozak scored less goals and less total points than Steener last year. Anyone think Steen was producing like a top 6 forward last year?
Steen scored right around the 180th spot in P/60 last year. He scored like a fringe 2nd/3rd liner. He was overpaid, but he definitely scored like a guy who could play in the top 6 and his defense is still above average.
This is entirely my point, when you have a crapload of fringe 2nd/3rd liners, you have a lot of crappy depth. Teams that win have better players getting prime minutes.
albertmvpujols wrote:JCShutout wrote:The cost and term are okay... when you have one or two of these guys, not 6, which the Blues have. Berglund, Boat, Steen, Bozak, Perron, Gunnarson, JayBo. Oh [expletive], 7 bad contracts, not six. Awesome. At some point, you can't pounce on an opportunity to take on an elite talent that comes available, or keep better young players because you spend $30m/year for those 7 players.
Berglund/Sobotka/Gunnarson/JayBo can't fill the positions that Bozak/Perron can. We had a need for a top 6 center and a top 9 RH shot forward. Previous bad deals shouldn't keep you from making current deals to upgrade the team. And nobody should be complaining about what JayBo brought to the team. He was well worth his contract until the injuries brought him down. Both he and Gunnarson are off the books in a year and Dunn/Edmundson have replaced the need for either.
JayBo was worth his contract for a year. I don't blame Army for signing him. I supported it. Stuff like that happens. It sucks, but injuries happen. I even thought the Steen signing was okay at the time (thought too long a term), because I think there is a place for players like these, even when they slow down, but not for 7 of them.
We had a big need for a top 6 center and Bozak doesn't fill it. He's a really expensive great third line/crappy 2nd line center. Stastny scored one more goal and 3 less total points as a Blue in 63 games than Bozak did in 81 with the Leafs... a Leaf team with twice as many 20+ goal scorers than the Blues last year. (6 to 3)
You can't just fill your team with fringy guys. You need enough top talent to make multiple lines a real threat. The Blues don't need more fringy guys, they have those in droves. They need top, legit scoring line talent. Not fringy. Not "in a good year", but any year, 60+ point potential.
Now, ROR changes everything. Two bad contracts gone, and clearly the Blues are going for it. Bozak and Perron look way better on the 3rd line, or as supplementary occasional 2nd liners (depending on how some of the kids do). I still don't think we needed both. I would have been happy letting kids pick up the slack, though I can understand signing one to make sure kids have time to develop.
albertmvpujols wrote:JCShutout wrote:I felt like we had to move one bad salary before today. Two would be ideal. Now we need to move 3 terrible contracts, at least. Two to only be in as bad a shape as last year. Hopefully Gunnarson and Jaybo go away after this year... though Armstrong will probably resign both for a combined $7m/year because Vince Dunn made one mistake in a Nov game in which he scored 3 points or something.
We definitely needed to move two contracts out (and we did in the ROR deal). I'm not sure why we need to move out another. And the last sentence here is hyperbole. The Blues have never worked young players into the lineup as well as any other team. The Blues aren't likely to sign either player again and if they do it'll be as a cheap bottom pairing role.
Of course its hyperbole. I'm arguing hockey on a message board. None of this is actually important. Its just for fun.
We are probably okay now because we got what we needed, an actual legit scoring line player. I'd still love for us to lose another salary and I think we need another top player, but with two bad D contracts coming off the books next year, we should be okay. I feel way better about one kid having a great year than needing two.
albertmvpujols wrote:JCShutout wrote:If the kids excel, then great, that will cover mistakes, but banking on that rarely works... and knowing Yeo, they will get 12 min/night on the 4th line.
Army likes Thomas a ton. If he's playing on the 4th line I don't think Yeo will be the coach for long. That would be for the best probably, so I hope it happens.
Honestly I was just ranting. I have no clue how Yeo will use the kids. My fear is they never get a chance. I do understand not giving them too much responsibility too soon.
albertmvpujols wrote:JCShutout wrote:Also, Boat needed to be moved before these signings. Now he REALLY needs to be moved. And Berglund, and Gunnarson. (Doubt someone will take Bouw or Steen unless they play well, in which case we will want to keep them)
Basically, we need someone to take Boat away, and we need Steen and JayBo to go back in time, as well as Perron and Bozak to have Schenn-like increases in performance. Its not impossible, just really expensive and unlikely.
It's hard for me to comment on this after the fact now that Sobotka and Berglund are gone, but with that you should be happy. The Blues don't need to get rid of anyone else. All they have left to sign for the main roster is Eddy (I'd love a 5-7 year deal in the 4-4.5 range), Fabbri (probably 2 year bridge deal in the 2-2.5 mil range), and Jaskin (around a million).
I was as hard on Armstrong as anyone but I feel like he has really had two great offseasons in a row.
I love Eddy but 4-4.5 mill/year is way too much for him. He's a guy I'd stretch for, but I'm looking more at $3m/year as my ceiling. Role players are great, but in this NHL, offensive talent is at a premium.
I still say we could lose another role player and need another legit top 6 guy in his place, but I think we are better now than we were last year, at least on paper. I do like Bozak and Perron more than Boat and Berglund, though the cost is also higher and I don't think we need both. We will see. I also think Perron could be solid with the right center, so lets see how it shakes out. Still hate the 4 years for him. Rather have 2.
I'd say last offseason was an A, this year is a B, mostly because I hate the term on the Bozak and Perron deals. 4+ years should be for core players. (Worried about Bozak's age with 3 years.)
EDIT: My reason for hating the Bozak trade so much is his age. a 32 year old isn't going to suddenly get better. That salary could look awful in a year or two if he's putting up Lehtera level production.
