Per Bernie : Jocketty is OUT!!!

[boyer14]

My distaste for Mr. DeWitt just went up exponentially. Now, we can look forward to year after year of mediocrity, with some exciting players that have come through our system but never acquiring the ones we need to be an elite team.

Check a few pages back on my "Terry Ryan is OUT at Minnesota" thread...what I expressed there, is what I feel about this move.

[haltz]

I just stepped outside and heard the rumor too, actually. Then the guy asked me if I had any change.

so, do people just walk around the streets of Chicago yelling random baseball news stories/rumors?

Most of the time. I figured it out, though. If you aren't paying attention, it just sounds like the wind. But if you stop and listen closely, you can hear the rumor. It's coming from everywhere.

I really like Jocketty. Always have. But I don't think this represents a 180 or something. It seems like a lot of the time, the system that's been built is more important than the actual person. Whether it be Terry Ryan, Walt Jocketty, or MGL. I'm sure there will be some changes, but I'd be wary of drawing quick conclusions.

[BW23]

I think it will be very interesting to see the comments by guys like Pujols, Edmonds, Rolen, Carp and even Molina and Wainwright the next couple of days.

[docellis]

i guess this is the perfect ending to the worst season ever.

That sums it up pretty well.

[Hungary Jack]

I'll have to thinnk about this a lot more, but for now, I think it's important to keep in mind that tehre are two sides to this.

Jocketty's decisions have not worked out super-well for a bit now; the extension to Carp two years early, the extension to Edmonds instead of picking up a cheaper one year option, the decision to resign Mulder for two years and at least $12mm (will he pitch any of it?), failing to land, well, ANY of the attractive players he targeted last off-season . . . combined with the notion that he apparently did not see eye to eye with the player development side of his own house . . .

really, when I think about it more, I may feel a lot more strongly one way or t'other, but my first reaction is, I am not convinced it is such a bad decision. And if TLR and Dunc go too -- well, no one has EVER heard me wish ANY of them were gone, but maybe it is time. None of these three are exactly known for their aptitude or fondness for building a team from the bottom up, and whether re-tooling on the fly this off-season or not, that clearly is the long-term, big-picture direction the team is pointing in.

I agree. Change is shocking and sometimes painful, especially when one considers Walt's impact on the franchise as it emerged from the horror of the early 1990's.

But Walt's performance over the past year (since winning the WS) grades out to an F, IMO, for the decisions you cite, primarily Carp and Mulder, as well as misreading the FA market for starters.

Did he deserve to get fired over this? No--his track record before was good enough to give the benefit of any doubt. But if the organization is moving in a different philosophical direction, and Walt wasn't fully on board, then the time to go was rapidly approaching. It just arrived a year earlier than expected.

[clevername]

espn is carrying the story now, though it just reports what the PD says.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3047912

I agree this isn't as doom and gloom as some would make it. I really like Jocketty as our GM, though.

[skmsw]

Like it or not, this ship has changed sails as of late last year with the promo of Luhnow. If I look at it at the 500 foot view I don't like it - despite a few head scratchers WJ has been the man in charge of one of the most successful periods in Cardinal history. If I look at it from the 50,000 foot view though, I don't know if it looks so bad. The sleeping giant to the north is rumbling, and if she ever wakes up for good she could pose some problems if we just follow the status quo. Maybe the way to deal with her is a Moneyball approach - something Luhnow fits the model for and WJ (and TLR) don't.

That might be comforting if there was a player quality that was under-valued, as when Beane was doing his thing. It seems that no stone is left unturned these days, though.

The Red Sox front office had a similar falling-out a couple years ago.

One side believed that the only way to compete with the Yankees was to have a steady stream of cheap, effective, young players contributing every season, and that there might be a brief down-period that had to be survived in order to have that pipeline -- that there was no way except luck that you could go with an all-productive-veteran team and hope to compete with the Yankees, who would always out-bid you and have better veterans.

This approach meant committing to a handful of younger players rather than filling the job with vets, and taking some lumps while the approach is refined.

The side faction felt that the vets were the key to maintaining a contending, popular, media-friendly team, and that while you'd fall short you'd always be in it and any given year things could fall into place.

As Jim points out, given the potential resources the Cubs can eventually deploy, this debate may well be being had at 250 Stadium Plaza (or whatever the address may be). And Walt not is playing the part of Theo.

[jim]

My distaste for Mr. DeWitt just went up exponentially. Now, we can look forward to year after year of mediocrity, with some exciting players that have come through our system but never acquiring the ones we need to be an elite team.

Check a few pages back on my "Terry Ryan is OUT at Minnesota" thread...what I expressed there, is what I feel about this move.

You pretty much had a hunch this was coming once Luhnow was promoted, no?

[docellis]

I think it will be very interesting to see the comments by guys like Pujols, Edmonds, Rolen, Carp and even Molina and Wainwright the next couple of days.

I know they can call and e-mail them but I don't think any of these people live in St. Louis.

I read that Juan lives in the city, owns a residence downtown.

[Simbagal23]

Thanks, Izzy.

(sorry, I couldn't resist)