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Arthur Dent wrote:

Freed Roger wrote:As far as avoiding this problem in the future when mastermind Mr. Fuzzypants orders up another trash job, I find that after-the fact punishment has little effect. The pillage instinct (wasn't a problem so much with only one dog) outweighs the shame aspect that they undoubtedly feel afterwards.

Somewhere, I read about a dog behavior experiment in just this situation that concluded that the shame is a projection by the owner. The dog is looking that way because it knows you're upset not because it feels any shame over the garbage invasion. Punishment after the fact is typically considered somewhere between pointless and harmful. If you don't catch the dog in the act, they aren't going to make the connection. If you can't booby trap the garbage, maybe you can secure it some way?

Yeah, they need to be caught in the act of doing it. It's weird, they'll root through the trash, and then see the trash scattered about and know that this is bad and I need to get away, but they don't make the connection to their actions.

Yeah, a dog trainer that I used when Oscar was a puppy told me that when you're training a puppy right from wrong (i.e. housebreaking them, among other things), you only have roughly 3-5 seconds to catch them after the act before they can no longer make the connection to doing the deed and it being wrong.

When they're an adult, it basically doubles - so 6-10 seconds to catch them. Meaning, for all intents and purposes, if you don't catch them while they're rooting through the trash, then any after-the-fact punishment/training is worthless.

Swirls wrote:Yeah, a dog trainer that I used when Oscar was a puppy told me that when you're training a puppy right from wrong (i.e. housebreaking them, among other things), you only have roughly 3-5 seconds to catch them after the act before they can no longer make the connection to doing the deed and it being wrong.

When they're an adult, it basically doubles - so 6-10 seconds to catch them. Meaning, for all intents and purposes, if you don't catch them while they're rooting through the trash, then any after-the-fact punishment/training is worthless.

I have heard this.

However, housebreaking was always fairly quick/easy at our house -- broke the above rule and would stick the dogs nose in their own dung/pee when occurred inside regardless of time frame. Of course coupled with getting them outside at opportune times and positive reinforcement for success.

Surprised the Will Ferrell commercial for dog training "you're a @#ucking dog!" has yet to appear.

Had to put my near 16 year old dog last night down. She had a tumor in her stomach that had tripled in size and went downhill the last couple of days real quick. I think the younger dog understands....

Sorry to hear that man. Its rough.

Sorry Jeff. I shudder to think of that day, hopefully a long time from now, when I'll have to say goodbye to my dog. Hope your fam is taking it well.

jeffbgoofy wrote:Had to put my near 16 year old dog last night down. She had a tumor in her stomach that had tripled in size and went downhill the last couple of days real quick. I think the younger dog understands....

Sorry to hear that, jeff. Hopefully that time is far off for us (ours are 6 and 5). They are so connected, I'm not sure how the surviving dog will handle it. Good to hear that yours seems to get it.

Thanks all. The younger will be 6 tomorrow. We will eventually get another or foster.

JackofDiamonds wrote:I prefer them. I'm just sayin'.

Seriously.