Michael Sam - NFL's first openly gay prospect

[Socnorb11]

It's impossible for his faith to not play a role in every opinion he holds or decision he makes if it is as important to him as he claims it is. Therefore, even if he's trying to be objective, it's impossible.

See, I completely disagree with this. Maybe I'm a bad Christian, but my Christianity has NO impact on most of the business decisions that I make on a daily basis. Seriously........ none.

This might be our disconnect. I grew up in a faith where to be a christian was to be Christ's representative on earth. Shining light on the hill, salt etc. It wasn't just believing that Jesus was God's son and died for sinners. If I took my role as an ambassador for Christ seriously, I would be mindful of that when giving an interview to a major media outlet.

Oh, I'm absolutely on board with being a representative of Christ. Christ was very fair with sinners. We should be, too. We're all sinners. His disciples were a bunch of ruffians, but he chose them anyway.

[Socnorb11]

Tony Dungy says it is the coach's job to put the best team on the field possible. Tony Dungy says Michael Sam is a good football player. Tony Dungy says a gay player would not be ostracized by teammates. Tony Dungy claims to be welcoming of people of all backgrounds. Tony Dungy says he would not draft Michael Sam.

...because it would be a distraction. Criticize him all you want because it is deserved, but at least don't lose sight of what he actually said.

Define distractions.

I didn't say it, so I can't define it. I'm just pointing out the conversation in this thread seems to have evolved to the point of "Tony Dungy said he wouldn't draft a gay football player" and that's not what he said. Would he draft a gay player? Probably not and that is likely because of his beliefs/bigotry. In my mind it's more likely that he meant he wouldn't like the media surrounding his team during camp asking the same questions over and over.

Sounds great until you remember Tim Tebow and Mike Vick.

Did he say he'd draft those guys?

[Jocephus]

Tony Dungy tried to quell the uproar over his comments against drafting openly gay football player Michael Sam by saying it wasn't Sam's sexual orientation he feared, but rather the documentary TV series that was filming Sam's rookie season. He said:

I gave my honest answer, which is that I felt drafting him would bring much distraction to the team. At the time of my interview, the Oprah Winfrey reality show that was going to chronicle Michael's first season had been announced.

In addition to Dungy's timing being murky (he said he was interviewed nine weeks ago, while the interviewer said it was two weeks ago), his memory must be going as well.

Back in 2009 when Dungy was asking NFL teams to take a shot on Michael Vick, the beleaguered quarterback coming out of jail was being followed by, you guessed it, a film crew documenting Vicks' return to the NFL. The show would air the following January on BET and was titled The Michael Vick Project.

So if you're a dog-killing professed Christian and you have a TV show, Tony Dungy will go out of his way to champion you and ask NFL teams to welcome you. If you're a gay man and you have a TV show, he wouldn't even think of having you as part of his team.

To be super clear about what this is all about, you just have to take Dungy's own comments from 2009 about a conversation he had with Vick when he decided to become a big champion for Vick:

And the other thing I asked him was where the Lord was in all this. We talked about him growing up and having that side, that Christian background, but really getting to the NFL and feeling like he was his own guy. Somewhere in the course of all this he realized that he had left that spiritual side. When he kind of described that to me and the fact that he needed to get back closer to the Lord, that's when I said, 'I'm going to stay involved in this. I'm going to help you.'

It's that same Lord that Dungy has used to support anti-gay causes and say he doesn't agree with the gay "lifestyle." And, ultimately, it's that same Lord he is using to make judgments about whether he would draft Michael Sam if he were in the NFL (which, of course, he is not). Thank God.

The whole thing also points to the underbelly of homophobia in the sports media. Vick can have a reality show, but if Sam dares to it's a "distraction" and he must be cut from the Rams roster immediately. Sad.

http://www.outsports.com/2014/7/22/5928 ... sam-gay-tv

[thrill]

Did he say he'd draft those guys?

He "mentored" Vick to get him signed by an NFL team after prison and he said he'd draft Tebow #1 overall if he was the coach of the team with that pick.

[Jocephus]

Dungy championed Vick's re-entry into the NFL from prison. According to published reports at the time, Dungy even supported Vick's decision to do a reality TV show on BET: "The Michael Vick Project."

Dungy took a public, courageous and important stand backing Vick, a convicted felon. It was a calculated decision.

"I've visited a lot of prisons," Dungy told "60 Minutes" correspondent James Brown in 2009 during a segment on Vick. "That's something I do. And I know there are a lot of young men, especially African-American young men, who need a chance, who made a mistake, who did something wrong, who had a problem, but are looking to bounce back. That's what I've always been concerned about, not just for Michael Vick, but for hundreds of guys that I've talked to."

What Dungy understands is that within American culture there is a deep-seated, opportunity-depriving hostility toward ex-cons. Our society deems them as unworthy of equality. Many people do not "want to deal with all" that goes into providing opportunities for men and women who have made mistakes because there is a pervasive fear that things won't go "totally smooth ... things will happen."

Dungy stepped up as a leader, mentored Vick and advocated for NFL franchises to deal with whatever media-driven distractions -- and there were many -- Vick's presence on the roster would present. By his own admission, Dungy did it because he recognized the larger societal impact Vick's return to the NFL could make. Dungy has been educated on the damage inflicted upon black and brown men by America's immoral and unevenly executed war on drugs and love affair with mass incarceration.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11252 ... el-sam-nfl

[KyCardinalFan]

Tony Dungy says it is the coach's job to put the best team on the field possible. Tony Dungy says Michael Sam is a good football player. Tony Dungy says a gay player would not be ostracized by teammates. Tony Dungy claims to be welcoming of people of all backgrounds. Tony Dungy says he would not draft Michael Sam.

...because it would be a distraction. Criticize him all you want because it is deserved, but at least don't lose sight of what he actually said.

Define distractions.

I didn't say it, so I can't define it. I'm just pointing out the conversation in this thread seems to have evolved to the point of "Tony Dungy said he wouldn't draft a gay football player" and that's not what he said. Would he draft a gay player? Probably not and that is likely because of his beliefs/bigotry. In my mind it's more likely that he meant he wouldn't like the media surrounding his team during camp asking the same questions over and over.

EXACTLY!

People think Dungy said, "I wouldn't draft him because he is gay."

He said he wouldn't draft him because "I wouldn't want to deal with all of it."

[haltz]

Tony Dungy tried to quell the uproar over his comments against drafting openly gay football player Michael Sam by saying it wasn't Sam's sexual orientation he feared, but rather the documentary TV series that was filming Sam's rookie season. He said:

I gave my honest answer, which is that I felt drafting him would bring much distraction to the team. At the time of my interview, the Oprah Winfrey reality show that was going to chronicle Michael's first season had been announced.

In addition to Dungy's timing being murky (he said he was interviewed nine weeks ago, while the interviewer said it was two weeks ago), his memory must be going as well.

Back in 2009 when Dungy was asking NFL teams to take a shot on Michael Vick, the beleaguered quarterback coming out of jail was being followed by, you guessed it, a film crew documenting Vicks' return to the NFL. The show would air the following January on BET and was titled The Michael Vick Project.

So if you're a dog-killing professed Christian and you have a TV show, Tony Dungy will go out of his way to champion you and ask NFL teams to welcome you. If you're a gay man and you have a TV show, he wouldn't even think of having you as part of his team.

To be super clear about what this is all about, you just have to take Dungy's own comments from 2009 about a conversation he had with Vick when he decided to become a big champion for Vick:

And the other thing I asked him was where the Lord was in all this. We talked about him growing up and having that side, that Christian background, but really getting to the NFL and feeling like he was his own guy. Somewhere in the course of all this he realized that he had left that spiritual side. When he kind of described that to me and the fact that he needed to get back closer to the Lord, that's when I said, 'I'm going to stay involved in this. I'm going to help you.'

It's that same Lord that Dungy has used to support anti-gay causes and say he doesn't agree with the gay "lifestyle." And, ultimately, it's that same Lord he is using to make judgments about whether he would draft Michael Sam if he were in the NFL (which, of course, he is not). Thank God.

The whole thing also points to the underbelly of homophobia in the sports media. Vick can have a reality show, but if Sam dares to it's a "distraction" and he must be cut from the Rams roster immediately. Sad.

http://www.outsports.com/2014/7/22/5928 ... sam-gay-tv

Case closed.

[thrill]

EXACTLY!

People think Dungy said, "I wouldn't draft him because he is gay."

He said he wouldn't draft him because "I wouldn't want to deal with all of it."

The Tebow comments and Vick story indicate an inequity in who he supports and deems worthy of distraction and who he doesn't and the obvious thing that separates them is faith and sexuality.
We are inferring some, but it's plenty obvious.

Edit - for all I know, Dungy would be as personally supportive so Sam on a professional level as he was to Tebow and Vick. What I do know is that he should have said that if he didn't want people to draw conclusions. The anti-marriage equality stuff is irrefutable but still understandable enough to some that it wouldn't be used as evidence against him if he had said something to support Sam.

[KyCardinalFan]

Tony Dungy:

I was not asked whether I would have a problem having Michael Sam on my team. I would not. ...

... I do not believe Michael's sexual orientation will be a distraction to his teammates or his organization.

I do, however, believe that the media attention that comes with it will be a distraction. Unfortunately we are all seeing this play out now, and I feel badly that my remarks played a role in the distraction.

[lukethedrifter]

EXACTLY!

People think Dungy said, "I wouldn't draft him because he is gay."

He said he wouldn't draft him because "I wouldn't want to deal with all of it."

not really exactly. to reiterate, he has gone out on a limb for guys who would be major nongay distractions in the past.

And we understand what he said. We disagree about why he said it and what it means when you try to look at the context.