Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin

[BW23]

On July 20, 2008, the pastor of Vice Presidential candidate Sarah Palin's home church, Larry Kroon, delivered a sermon called "Sin Is Personal To God." Kroon, the senior pastor of the non-denominational Wasilla Bible Church in Wasilla, Alaska, used the book of Zephaniah as his reference point for discussing "that great day of the Lord, when God will finally bring closure to human history... a day of wrath." According to Kroon, "all things and all people" are going to bear the brunt of God's "intense anger." "There's anger with God," he proclaimed. "He takes sin personal."

Kroon placed Zephaniah in a modern context, warning that the sinful habits of Americans would invite the wrath of God. "And if Zephaniah were here today," Kroon bellowed, "he'd be saying, ‘Listen, [God] is gonna deal with all the inhabitants of the earth. He is gonna strike out His hand against, yes, Wasilla; and Alaska; and the United States of America. There's no exceptions here -- there's none. It's all.'"

(Kroon's sermon can be heard here; a full transcript is here.)

While Kroon has cautioned his parishioners against the mass marketed End Times prophecies of Hal Lindsey and Tim LaHaye, he has nonetheless invoked doomsday scenarios that mirror those on the pages of Lindsey and LaHaye's bestselling tracts.

"It's so very possible that God, instead of responding by granting spiritual renewal and sustained prosperity," Kroon said in a sermon on July 13, 2008, "could just as easily...it's conceivable that He could just as easily, for example, raise up a revived, prosperous and powerful Communist Russia with a web of alliances across the Middle East. And our gas pumps would go dry. The dollar would collapse. And the markets would crash. The kayak could go upside down. And it could happen in a matter of weeks. That could happen. It could happen by this fall."

Palin joined Wasilla Bible Church after leaving Wasilla Assembly of God, a Pentecostal church where she delivered a controversial sermon asking her audience to pray that the war in Iraq is "God's plan." When she is working in Alaska's capitol, she worships at the Juneau Christian Center, another Pentecostal church where charismatic displays like speaking in tongues and dancing in the spirit are encouraged. Palin describes herself as a "Bible-believing Christian."

Palin's presence at Wasilla Bible Church has not been confirmed for the days Kroon warned of God "striking out his hand against... the United States of America" and "rais[ing] up" an alliance of nations to ruin America.

http://www.thenation.com/blogs/campaignmatters/355545

Irony.

Irony? Hardly.

[BW23]

The first time I could ever vote I voted for a Dem.

It will be the last time, too.

No offense, but that seems like a pretty close-minded attitude.

Offense taken.

I can't relate to anything about the Democratic party. And that's the party that would "help" my profession the most. It's not that I'm happy with a lot of things that happen within the Republican party. The most glaring example of that is one John McCain. (I didn't even vote for the guy I wanted in the primary because I was trying to vote along the lines with the guy that had the slight chance of knocking off McCain.) But, it's the best alternative out there for me.

And I don't ever, ever, ever seeing that being the Democratic party again. I can't imagine anything happening in my life that would change me so much as to even consider voting for a Dem pres. Ever.

[Jocephus]

And here I thought Obama was the one playing nice. This and his campaign saying that the Palins are bad parents. Gee, it's really shocking.

i dont really get what you are saying....is he playing mean with that 40 second clip?

did his campaign say that the palins were bad parents? i may have missed it. id like to read that.

[BW23]

He didn't say it. Someone in his camp did yesterday.

I'm being tongue-in-cheek with the clip.

Here's the parenting story.

http://www.stoptheaclu.com/archives/200 ... rd-gutman/

I heard about it on the news earlier. Just did a search for it and found this among many.

Let's see if Obama fires this guy. He hasn't yet.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch ... paign.html

[Jocephus]

thanks. i dont own a tv, so i miss a lot of things (which may be a good thing...)

edit: heres his whole speech in terra haute...fwiw...[10 mins]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSmn25rvQRo

[Radbird]

And until there's a relevant third party in America, this game of "blame the other" and yellow journalism that the parties' play will continue. And will get worse.

Interesting, Cronos. I voted for Perot in '92, not because I liked him, or thought he could win, but because I had hopes that enough votes might help get that 3rd party established.

Just for the record, I have gone through several liberal/conservative/liberal phases in my life, as witnessed by presidential votes.

1972 - Nixon - R (don't ask me why. McGovern just didn't cut it with me.)
1976 - Carter - D
1980 - Reagan - R
1984 - Reagan - R
1988 - Bush - R
1992 - Perot - I
1996 - Clinton - D
2000 - Bush - R (I bought the uniter not divider crap)
2004 - Kerry - D
2008 - Obama - D (leaning)

That tallies up to 5 R, 4 D, and 1 I. I would've voted for Clinton in '92 if not for that 3rd party whim in '92, it'd be all even if I stick with Obama this fall.

[MrSaigon]

It's funny to watch history repeat itself and change parties. First it was Obama's guru now it's Palin's. First it was Kerry's war record now it's McCain's.
It's just funny how entirely atrocious things are when they are being heaped onto one party and how perfectly acceptable they are when the are being heaped upon the other and vice versa.

God I love Republicans and Democrats.

[Richie Allen]

And I don't ever, ever, ever seeing that being the Democratic party again. I can't imagine anything happening in my life that would change me so much as to even consider voting for a Dem pres. Ever.

I think we're all fooling ourselves if we think there's that much difference between the two parties. Sure, the stances on the issues and the talking points are all neatly divided between the two parties and they use those to manipulate voters but in reality those issues have very little to do with how either party governs.

[GatewaySnayke]

Here's a pretty good article. Pray away the gay!

Palin church promotes converting gays
By RACHEL D'ORO Associated Press Writer

Print Sep 5th, 2008 | ANCHORAGE, Alaska -- Gov. Sarah Palin's church is promoting a conference that promises to convert gays into heterosexuals through the power of prayer.

"You'll be encouraged by the power of God's love and His desire to transform the lives of those impacted by homosexuality," according to the insert in the bulletin of the Wasilla Bible Church, where Palin has prayed for about six years.

Palin's conservative Christian views have energized that part of the GOP electorate, which was lukewarm to John McCain's candidacy before he named her as his vice presidential choice. She is staunchly anti-abortion, opposing exceptions for rape and incest, and opposes gay marriage and spousal rights for gay couples.

Focus on the Family, a national Christian fundamentalist organization, is conducting the "Love Won Out" Conference in Anchorage, about 30 miles from Wasilla.

Palin, campaigning with McCain in the Midwest on Friday, has not publicly expressed a view on the so-called "pray away the gay" movement. Larry Kroon, senior pastor at Palin's church, was not available to discuss the matter Friday, said a church worker who declined to give her name.

Gay activists in Alaska said Palin has not worked actively against their interests, but early in her administration she supported a bill to overrule a court decision to block state benefits for gay partners of public employees. At the time, less than one-half of 1 percent of state employees had applied for the benefits, which were ordered by a 2005 ruling by the Alaska Supreme Court.

Palin reversed her position and vetoed the bill after the state attorney general said it was unconstitutional. But her reluctant support didn't win fans among Alaska's gay population, said Scott Turner, a gay activist in Anchorage.

"Less than 1 percent of state employees would even apply for benefits, so why make a big deal out of such a small number?" he said.

"I think gay Republicans are going to run away" if Palin supports efforts like the prayers to convert gays, said Wayne Besen, founder of the New York-based Truth Wins Out, a gay rights advocacy group. Besen called on Palin to publicly express her views now that she's a vice presidential nominee.

"People are looking at Sarah Palin as someone who might feasibly be in the White House," he said.

http://www.salon.com/wires/ap/2008/09/0 ... index.html

[Jocephus]

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