Former Cardinals Watch

[Swirls]

OF Traded: 4.9 total bWAR among Piscotty (2.4), Grichuk (1.6), and Pham (0.9 since trade).
OF Added : 7.5 total bWAR among Ozuna (2.6), Bader (3.7), and O'Neill (1.2).

It's easy to look former players up and lament trading them away, but sometimes there are valuable guys who just aren't the right fit for what you're trying to accomplish. People want to look at what Pham is doing in Tampa in isolation and say we made a bad deal, but the game isn't played on paper and that complaint doesn't take into account what we replaced him with.

Getting Tommy out of the organization was a good call and that's not a slam on the Cards or Pham. He just wasn't the right guy. Meanwhile, creating playing time for Bader/O'Neill worked.

That may be able to be bumped up a bit, since JMart is splitting time in RF with O'Neill. Although I suspect Martinez is basically replacement level (or below replacement level) in the outfield defensively.

[Hoot45]

OF Traded: 4.9 total bWAR among Piscotty (2.4), Grichuk (1.6), and Pham (0.9 since trade).
OF Added : 7.5 total bWAR among Ozuna (2.6), Bader (3.7), and O'Neill (1.2).

It's easy to look former players up and lament trading them away, but sometimes there are valuable guys who just aren't the right fit for what you're trying to accomplish. People want to look at what Pham is doing in Tampa in isolation and say we made a bad deal, but the game isn't played on paper and that complaint doesn't take into account what we replaced him with.

Getting Tommy out of the organization was a good call and that's not a slam on the Cards or Pham. He just wasn't the right guy. Meanwhile, creating playing time for Bader/O'Neill worked.

That may be able to be bumped up a bit, since JMart is splitting time in RF with O'Neill. Although I suspect Martinez is basically replacement level (or below replacement level) in the outfield defensively.

Good point. It's not really a straight comparison of 7.5 to 4.9 because JMart was in the mix and Pham provided some value while he was here. But the idea that you can unload valuable players who don't fit and still be OK still stands I think.

[InvincibleCakeEater]

It was a stupid ass trade near term.

[Big Amoco Sign]

I think it's silly to justify the Tommy Pham trade with untruths like him being a non-fit or whatever.

If Tommy Pham isn't "the right guy" then I don't know what kind of team you'd want. He's someone I want 9 of on game day. Guy works harder than anyone. Best all around talent we had on this roster despite a mediocre couple of months.

Last year's OF was better than this year's. 8.4 fWAR this year for OF and 12.3 last year. Unless you think we climb nearly 4 fWAR in the remaining games. Yes I know you said "OF traded" and picked some arbitrary goal posts, but the fact remains.

The trade sucked ass. No way around it.

[AWvsCBsteeeerike3]

I think it's silly to justify the Tommy Pham trade with untruths like him being a non-fit or whatever.

If Tommy Pham isn't "the right guy" then I don't know what kind of team you'd want. He's someone I want 9 of on game day. Guy works harder than anyone. Best all around talent we had on this roster despite a mediocre couple of months.

Last year's OF was better than this year's. 8.4 fWAR this year for OF and 12.3 last year. Unless you think we climb nearly 4 fWAR in the remaining games. Yes I know you said "OF traded" and picked some arbitrary goal posts, but the fact remains.

The trade sucked ass. No way around it.

Yeah, it was one of those head-scratchers.

[InvincibleCakeEater]

Kozma is somehow back in the bigs.

The Tigers have selected the contract of veteran infielder Pete Kozma from Triple-A Toledo and created roster space by transferring Jose Iglesias from the 10-day DL to the 60-day DL, per a club announcement.

[Big Amoco Sign]

Kozma is somehow back in the bigs.

The Tigers have selected the contract of veteran infielder Pete Kozma from Triple-A Toledo and created roster space by transferring Jose Iglesias from the 10-day DL to the 60-day DL, per a club announcement.

Could have used him against Kershaw last night.

[heyzeus]

I will never understand the Pham trade. Or the fact that we went on a tear almost immediately afterward.

If it really was a case of his "fit" within the organization, then we should have traded him at the end of the 2017 season when he posted 6.1 WAR - a figure we all agreed was likely to be a career high. No doubt his personality, and whether it would be a fit, was known at that point, and his trade value would've netted more than two mediocre prospects.

[Hoot45]

I will never understand the Pham trade. Or the fact that we went on a tear almost immediately afterward.

I admire that for you these two things can coexist. It might not make sense, but that doesn't mean it didn't work for both the Cardinals and for Pham in the near term. I just hope Bader can lock down the position and the Cardinals are right in guessing that an almost 31-year old Pham won't contribute as much value as Harrison over the next few years.

If it really was a case of his "fit" within the organization, then we should have traded him at the end of the 2017 season when he posted 6.1 WAR - a figure we all agreed was likely to be a career high. No doubt his personality, and whether it would be a fit, was known at that point, and his trade value would've netted more than two mediocre prospects.

The biggest thing I've been wondering is how much of Pham's relative struggles and clubhouse controversies were linked to the same 2018 spell cast by Matheny that had seemingly frustrated the rest of the team as well. Is it possible he didn't fit with a piece that they had already moved?

Pham was batting .238/.322/.392/.714 this year under Matheny in a not-so-insignificant 396 PA's while posting negative value defense. Post-Matheny, he slashed .323/.415/.512/.927, including a solid two week stretch batting .325/.400/.450/.850 under Shildt & Associates. Would Pham have turned his season around post-Matheny like the ball club did, or did he really need his own change of scenery to get back on track? Sometimes fit isn't about the player for the team, but rather the team for the player. Whatever the reason, he wasn't delivering an encore to his 2017 F-U Tour, and moving him along worked for both the Cardinals and Tommy.

[Socnorb11]

I will never understand the Pham trade. Or the fact that we went on a tear almost immediately afterward.

His BABIP is over .400 since being traded.